Carolyn Rose: You have correctly understood that people are not calling Abbie ugly (because she obviously isn't), but I am not critiquing her looks either. I used her as an illustrative example to make a point about the fashion world. Pointing out why Abbie has what it takes to do high-fashion modeling is not criticism of her looks.
hi melisande, guinevere, and your other common names and everyone who replies/reads this post
before reviewing peer comments such as those above, i have never seen you from a "male" perspective. i am a straight guy. after reading someone's post above, i still can't see anything masculine about your work. i have quite a collection of your pieces and must say you've done quite a good job. the biggest factor that attributes to being of fan of yours is really your face.
symmetry is beauty as many will say. with slender body types and smaller structure, symmetry is easily achieved. that would probably be my explanation to why i, and many other heterosexual men would consider her a beauty.
the slender/slim figure equatable to a young boy is not applicable to guinevere/melisande imo.
corsets do make the waist smaller when worn regularly even when you're not wearing them. not as small, but smaller. and they are still dangerous to health, you haven't really countered me there. and the only argument you gave against my other points is that you think these methods don't make people look 'feminine' enough. does that mean they won't be considered. lots of people dislike breast implants, but thousands of people have them. you yourself show a strong preference for slim women, if they are not naturally slim should they put their health in danger by dieting to reach YOUR standard? you say no, but the fashion industry say they don't promote eating disorders. why are they so much worse than you, neither of you push realism or even acceptance.
and maybe the word 'ugly' wasn't used, but using "sexy" (in inverted commas) and discussing how it is incredible how someone so unattractive could be a model is calling them ugly, you're just being pedantic with how you interpret the word.
you also missed or ignored my point on the skinny models part. yes you explained why you think thin models are bad, but you never got round to saying why extreme hourglasses are any better for the self-esteem.
of course, when you start introducing the AGENDA OF THE GAY MAFIA (!!) you just make yourself sound ridiculous. i know plenty of heterosexual men who are attracted to heidi klum.
Girls.Abbies friends. I know she rocks , she is awesome, You love her.I get it.I am her cousin.And I love her too.I know this is exciting bcuz nothing happens in GR. Michigan,but I kinda agree with this Erik person.It nice once in a while to leave a comment to Abbie to tell her how amazing and far she will go.These people are critics, they are not saying she is ugly, cuz she not, but they are simply criticing the "look". There is nothing wrong with that.But I do disagree with Erik telling them{{you}} to play with barbies.Hun that was soooo 2nd gr.
But Abbie looks stunning in all her pics.For more go to Elitemodels.com under new faces, to see her awesome photos.
Abbie the pics are stunning absolutly stunning ;)
hi. i m a 24 yr old heighted 5.3 n underweight so what should b the best figure measurements 4 me.i d like it if u give on the site the figure measurements of aishwarya rai.i wanted 2 mail u but well...take care...n dont 4get 2 let me know.
the girls erica shows are kind of...mediocre. like... plain. nothing is special or striking about them. that's okay, but that's not suitable for modeling.
More Caucasians I know than Latinos think Jessica Alba is gorgeous. If you're in doubt, go to celebrity gossip websites where there are always posted photos of Alba and almost always, the comments are in admiration of her.
I don't understand how you don't find her the least bit attractive. She has the perfect face.
Her personality, on the other hand, makes me want to choke her.
The reason high-placed eyebrows with maximum height in the middle is more feminine is because it gives the woman a softer and sweeter look. The other two pictures (A & B) give a bitchy look to the woman.
I believe the reason younger males prefer picture A is because of the arching in the lateral third, which is considered more fashionable in modern days.
Personally, I prefer high-placed eyebrows but with the maximum arch in the third lateral.
Also, I was wondering when you were going to come up with an article on Miranda Kerr like you said you would. I'm a big fan of hers and want to know what you think is masculine about her.
Her legs may not be thick in general, but the rest of her body is pretty thin. However, after looking at the picture again, it looks as if she's pressing her leg onto the man behind her, so it might not be a valid picture to judge the size of her thighs.
Just out of curiosity, Erik, what do you think of the feminity of this particular fashion model?
A lot of male models have startingly feminine appearances.
Like Jarrod Branch
and Danila Polyakov:
and mathias lauridsen:
They are also all very thin. Now I wonder why they are chosen as models. If designers are only interested in teen boys shouldn't they chose models tnat look like teen boys? Maybe they are interested in variety and uniqueness more than they are interested in geting into a teen's tightie wighties. Maybe thinness is a general requirement for all models because of sample aizes and the variety of styles and silhouettes that a tall lean body will look presentable in. Maybe thin models give designers a lot of freedom with what they can send down the runway without the fear of unsightly bulges or vulgar folds of flesh spilling out and over. Maybe just maybe the whole world doesn't agree with you about waht is beautiful, feminine and worthy of admiration and emulation.
Dream on Eric, no one is going stop dieting because you tell them to stop and they certainly aren't going to stop in order to look more like your nasty models. The problem with your site is that you are a nobody which means that you are unable to hire beautiful "feminine" women represent your ideals. You have to rely an frowzy soft porn trailer trash as your examples of "feminine beauty". As a result, your arguments are even more unconvincing and you look like a fool with bad taste.
If I were you I would stick to the pseudoscience bullshit arguments until I could find some reasonably attractive Jessica Rabbit clones who are insane enough to model for creepy white supremacist nerds. Your "attractive" women section is a sad joke. If you achieve anything it will be getting more women to throw up their every meal in order to look as different from your "beauties" as possible. LOL!
Why don't you stop peddling your disgusting accusations if you don't have any solid proof to back it up? You are basically accusing these designers of being pederasts and you don't know if they have ever slept with or been attracted to a teenaged boy. I know you are going to come up with some bullshit "science" to back up your pathetic points but before you do that let me say that if they are attracted to teenagers they are certainly not alone. The amount of barely legal teen sites can attest that a lot of the members of your beloved "lifetime exclusive heterosexual" crowd have the same fantasies. Pederasty is illegal, disgusting and very frowned upon in western society so accusing these men of wanting to sleep with boys is basically slanderous.
I don't like your scuzzy, trailer park nude models. I don't think they are beautiful and I definately don't want them to be within a mile of couture clothing. Does that make me a pederast?
8D: What choice do I have but to respond if you keep repeating nonsense? At the very least I have to ask you to behave or leave.
Laura: I haven’t described high-fashion models as ugly. Ugliness results from physical defects/abnormalities, which high-fashion models lack. Making an objective argument requires citing evidence, not having my looks critiqued by others.
The “unhealthy practices” you have described in the pursuit of femininity are mostly misunderstandings:
Quote:
Corsets did not affect actual breast and hip size/shape; just their appearance in clothes. Corsets are also unable to alter the rib cage except the lower part and are thereby not able to provide a natural hourglass shape. This site is working toward promoting women with physiques that looks feminine without the aid of clothing/mini-corsets.
The physiological underpinnings of femininity correspond to deposition of fat away from the abdominal region and the development of a smaller rib cage. Therefore, non-pregnant women with abdominal fat sufficiently abundant so as to require surgical removal for aesthetic purposes have a low likelihood of being feminine in the first place and removing this excess fat will give them a narrower mid-section that will nevertheless not be narrow enough to be an example of feminine beauty. Regardless of the promotion of feminine beauty many individuals will desire minimal abdominal fat and some will undergo liposuction, but liposuction cannot render feminine a mid-section that is unfeminine with respect to lean tissue structures.
Breast implants are often not helpful in making a woman look feminine. A good way of understanding this is to go through the Victoria’s Secret model entries within this site. Start below and change the digit at the end to 2, 3, and so on for other entries (7 entries so far).
Many Victoria’s Secret models have breast implants, but they haven’t made them look feminine. Fake-looking breasts also don’t help in the beauty department.
A masculinizing effect will alter the entire face shape. Surgically altering one or two parts will not make a masculine face look feminine. Very few women will have the money and willingness to undergo multiple facial surgeries in order to look feminine, which also goes for multiple cosmetic surgery procedures on the body.
Cosmetic surgery procedures typically have short term risks. The more serious/major/dangerous the cosmetic surgery procedure, the more expensive and unaffordable it usually is and fewer people are willing to undergo it. On the other hand, starving oneself, which is inexpensive and within the means of just about all people, during one’s growing years results in a failure to reach the bone density one normally would and increased susceptibility to premature osteoporosis. Prolonged undereating can also harm the body to such an extent that resumption of normal eating will not restore one to the peak form prior to the commencement of disordered eating.
Whereas some studies have reported no change in women’s self-/body-esteem after viewing thinner models or even a positive change, the overall/general find is clear, namely that women’s body-esteem is worsened by looking at skinny models. You mentioned moderately thin models, but high-fashion models are typically thinner. The thinness of high-fashion models makes no marketing sense. The homosexuals are able to get away with it because they are using these models to sell highly desirable items and facing no competition.
Some “analyses” will be seen as insulting, but there is not much that I can do about it. How does one say that A is more attractive than B as far as most people are concerned and avoid showing B in an unflattering light?
hot92: If there are only two sexes then people in between these sexes are obviously neither sex and hence are sexless.
Sionnach: Yes, masculinization-feminization varies along a continuum with respect to individual physical features, and the more masculinized a woman is, the farther she is toward the masculine end of the continuum.
Women with the same sex hormone profile will respond differently to it if their steroid receptor profiles are different. Steroid hormones need to attach to certain receptors before they can affect gene expression. Physical features are also shaped by a variety of factors other than sex hormones and their receptors. If controlling for sex hormones and their receptors, a woman has the genetics of large feet, then even if she has a feminine sex hormone profile, her feet will be larger than most women with her sex hormone profile.
More masculine vs. more feminine features are best described as is in regard to a reference.
Your impression of U.S. research is partially correct. Whereas among white women higher socioeconomic status is universally associated with a lower prevalence of obesity, among numerous other ethnic groups in the U.S., the prevalence of obesity does not vary as a function of social class. However, the lower prevalence of obesity among upper class white women does not explain the typical thinness of high-fashion models either since this is much below what most whites prefer:
It is true that plumpness is more socially acceptable or even desirable among some non-European populations. Some information concerning European and African populations can be found here (scroll down to the part on obesity).
Domination of the fashion business by homosexual men means that people occupying the top rung in the business and thereby having the most influence on shaping it are often homosexual men. See this list of some big names in the fashion business.
Danielle: I have numerous objectives. I believe that I will succeed in bringing down the incidence of unnecessary dieting in the general female population. I may or may not succeed in establishing at least one mainstream outlet for feminine beauty appreciation. I acknowledge that coming up with a high-fashion alternative is the most difficult to achieve goal, but what is the point of giving up even if this cannot be achieved?
I am doing my job, not worrying about the results. The results -- at least some -- will come.
8D: Heed the warning about behaving. Bron has left numerous comments, and it should be clear that she is not me. I also have IP logs to prove this. I have addressed the misleading arguments by David Staples (your link) here.
Carolyn Rose: You have correctly understood that people are not calling Abbie ugly (because she obviously isn't), but I am not critiquing her looks either. I used her as an illustrative example to make a point about the fashion world. Pointing out why Abbie has what it takes to do high-fashion modeling is not criticism of her looks.
erica: only cause u dont have enough money and power to. you would if u could, bb.
http://www.fhm.com/100sexiestwinner/
http://www.askmen.com/specials/2007_top_99/
no further comments :-)
hi melisande, guinevere, and your other common names and everyone who replies/reads this post
before reviewing peer comments such as those above, i have never seen you from a "male" perspective. i am a straight guy. after reading someone's post above, i still can't see anything masculine about your work. i have quite a collection of your pieces and must say you've done quite a good job. the biggest factor that attributes to being of fan of yours is really your face.
symmetry is beauty as many will say. with slender body types and smaller structure, symmetry is easily achieved. that would probably be my explanation to why i, and many other heterosexual men would consider her a beauty.
the slender/slim figure equatable to a young boy is not applicable to guinevere/melisande imo.
regards
smiles
corsets do make the waist smaller when worn regularly even when you're not wearing them. not as small, but smaller. and they are still dangerous to health, you haven't really countered me there. and the only argument you gave against my other points is that you think these methods don't make people look 'feminine' enough. does that mean they won't be considered. lots of people dislike breast implants, but thousands of people have them. you yourself show a strong preference for slim women, if they are not naturally slim should they put their health in danger by dieting to reach YOUR standard? you say no, but the fashion industry say they don't promote eating disorders. why are they so much worse than you, neither of you push realism or even acceptance.
and maybe the word 'ugly' wasn't used, but using "sexy" (in inverted commas) and discussing how it is incredible how someone so unattractive could be a model is calling them ugly, you're just being pedantic with how you interpret the word.
you also missed or ignored my point on the skinny models part. yes you explained why you think thin models are bad, but you never got round to saying why extreme hourglasses are any better for the self-esteem.
of course, when you start introducing the AGENDA OF THE GAY MAFIA (!!) you just make yourself sound ridiculous. i know plenty of heterosexual men who are attracted to heidi klum.
Girls.Abbies friends. I know she rocks , she is awesome, You love her.I get it.I am her cousin.And I love her too.I know this is exciting bcuz nothing happens in GR. Michigan,but I kinda agree with this Erik person.It nice once in a while to leave a comment to Abbie to tell her how amazing and far she will go.These people are critics, they are not saying she is ugly, cuz she not, but they are simply criticing the "look". There is nothing wrong with that.But I do disagree with Erik telling them{{you}} to play with barbies.Hun that was soooo 2nd gr.
But Abbie looks stunning in all her pics.For more go to Elitemodels.com under new faces, to see her awesome photos.
Abbie the pics are stunning absolutly stunning ;)
hi. i m a 24 yr old heighted 5.3 n underweight so what should b the best figure measurements 4 me.i d like it if u give on the site the figure measurements of aishwarya rai.i wanted 2 mail u but well...take care...n dont 4get 2 let me know.
erica:
that means you were raised around inbred peepul. obviously.
8D
the girls erica shows are kind of...mediocre. like... plain. nothing is special or striking about them. that's okay, but that's not suitable for modeling.
8D
ps: indeed, erica likes the whities.
danielle:
that is so true.
hahaha...
and he didnt respond 2 twistytie's arguement. in fact, she prob deleted it cause it pwned her.
sarah:
yeah, miranda pwns.
only, erik's taste isn't good enough to see that.
and i am so glad that i deserved an entry mention!
and so glad to see that u r just as racist as ever, erica.
xoxo,
8D
More Caucasians I know than Latinos think Jessica Alba is gorgeous. If you're in doubt, go to celebrity gossip websites where there are always posted photos of Alba and almost always, the comments are in admiration of her.
I don't understand how you don't find her the least bit attractive. She has the perfect face.
Her personality, on the other hand, makes me want to choke her.
The reason high-placed eyebrows with maximum height in the middle is more feminine is because it gives the woman a softer and sweeter look. The other two pictures (A & B) give a bitchy look to the woman.
I believe the reason younger males prefer picture A is because of the arching in the lateral third, which is considered more fashionable in modern days.
Personally, I prefer high-placed eyebrows but with the maximum arch in the third lateral.
*femininity
Also, I was wondering when you were going to come up with an article on Miranda Kerr like you said you would. I'm a big fan of hers and want to know what you think is masculine about her.
http://img137.exs.cx/img137/4932/scan00058je.jpg
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/5999/mirandak49xy.jpg
Aww, Erik! When have I EVER misbehaved?
Her legs may not be thick in general, but the rest of her body is pretty thin. However, after looking at the picture again, it looks as if she's pressing her leg onto the man behind her, so it might not be a valid picture to judge the size of her thighs.
Just out of curiosity, Erik, what do you think of the feminity of this particular fashion model?
http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20070710/i/r2484346748.jpg?
I believe she models for a Latin American fashion company. She is probably the most feminine looking high-fashion model I've seen.
A lot of male models have startingly feminine appearances.
Like Jarrod Branch
and Danila Polyakov:
and mathias lauridsen:
They are also all very thin. Now I wonder why they are chosen as models. If designers are only interested in teen boys shouldn't they chose models tnat look like teen boys? Maybe they are interested in variety and uniqueness more than they are interested in geting into a teen's tightie wighties. Maybe thinness is a general requirement for all models because of sample aizes and the variety of styles and silhouettes that a tall lean body will look presentable in. Maybe thin models give designers a lot of freedom with what they can send down the runway without the fear of unsightly bulges or vulgar folds of flesh spilling out and over. Maybe just maybe the whole world doesn't agree with you about waht is beautiful, feminine and worthy of admiration and emulation.
I do not see the thick legs either.
Oh and I hope that these never come back:
Sorry to say that I would much rather look like this:
than this:
You have bad taste. Give up your useless crusade.
I can sum up your entire website for you with a couple pictures and sentences.
Models and pageant contestants should have bodies like this:
Faces like this:
But they all look like this:
And it makes you very very upset.
Oh and :
Dream on Eric, no one is going stop dieting because you tell them to stop and they certainly aren't going to stop in order to look more like your nasty models. The problem with your site is that you are a nobody which means that you are unable to hire beautiful "feminine" women represent your ideals. You have to rely an frowzy soft porn trailer trash as your examples of "feminine beauty". As a result, your arguments are even more unconvincing and you look like a fool with bad taste.
If I were you I would stick to the pseudoscience bullshit arguments until I could find some reasonably attractive Jessica Rabbit clones who are insane enough to model for creepy white supremacist nerds. Your "attractive" women section is a sad joke. If you achieve anything it will be getting more women to throw up their every meal in order to look as different from your "beauties" as possible. LOL!
Why don't you stop peddling your disgusting accusations if you don't have any solid proof to back it up? You are basically accusing these designers of being pederasts and you don't know if they have ever slept with or been attracted to a teenaged boy. I know you are going to come up with some bullshit "science" to back up your pathetic points but before you do that let me say that if they are attracted to teenagers they are certainly not alone. The amount of barely legal teen sites can attest that a lot of the members of your beloved "lifetime exclusive heterosexual" crowd have the same fantasies. Pederasty is illegal, disgusting and very frowned upon in western society so accusing these men of wanting to sleep with boys is basically slanderous.
I don't like your scuzzy, trailer park nude models. I don't think they are beautiful and I definately don't want them to be within a mile of couture clothing. Does that make me a pederast?
8D: What choice do I have but to respond if you keep repeating nonsense? At the very least I have to ask you to behave or leave.
Laura: I haven’t described high-fashion models as ugly. Ugliness results from physical defects/abnormalities, which high-fashion models lack. Making an objective argument requires citing evidence, not having my looks critiqued by others.
The “unhealthy practices” you have described in the pursuit of femininity are mostly misunderstandings:
Quote:
Whereas some studies have reported no change in women’s self-/body-esteem after viewing thinner models or even a positive change, the overall/general find is clear, namely that women’s body-esteem is worsened by looking at skinny models. You mentioned moderately thin models, but high-fashion models are typically thinner. The thinness of high-fashion models makes no marketing sense. The homosexuals are able to get away with it because they are using these models to sell highly desirable items and facing no competition.
Some “analyses” will be seen as insulting, but there is not much that I can do about it. How does one say that A is more attractive than B as far as most people are concerned and avoid showing B in an unflattering light?
hot92: If there are only two sexes then people in between these sexes are obviously neither sex and hence are sexless.
Sionnach: Yes, masculinization-feminization varies along a continuum with respect to individual physical features, and the more masculinized a woman is, the farther she is toward the masculine end of the continuum.
Women with the same sex hormone profile will respond differently to it if their steroid receptor profiles are different. Steroid hormones need to attach to certain receptors before they can affect gene expression. Physical features are also shaped by a variety of factors other than sex hormones and their receptors. If controlling for sex hormones and their receptors, a woman has the genetics of large feet, then even if she has a feminine sex hormone profile, her feet will be larger than most women with her sex hormone profile.
More masculine vs. more feminine features are best described as is in regard to a reference.
Your impression of U.S. research is partially correct. Whereas among white women higher socioeconomic status is universally associated with a lower prevalence of obesity, among numerous other ethnic groups in the U.S., the prevalence of obesity does not vary as a function of social class. However, the lower prevalence of obesity among upper class white women does not explain the typical thinness of high-fashion models either since this is much below what most whites prefer:
http://www.femininebeauty.info/news.php/weblog/comments/body_fat_preference/
http://www.femininebeauty.info/news.php/weblog/comments/bmi/
http://www.femininebeauty.info/news.php/weblog/comments/acnielsen/
It is true that plumpness is more socially acceptable or even desirable among some non-European populations. Some information concerning European and African populations can be found here (scroll down to the part on obesity).
Domination of the fashion business by homosexual men means that people occupying the top rung in the business and thereby having the most influence on shaping it are often homosexual men. See this list of some big names in the fashion business.
Danielle: I have numerous objectives. I believe that I will succeed in bringing down the incidence of unnecessary dieting in the general female population. I may or may not succeed in establishing at least one mainstream outlet for feminine beauty appreciation. I acknowledge that coming up with a high-fashion alternative is the most difficult to achieve goal, but what is the point of giving up even if this cannot be achieved?
I am doing my job, not worrying about the results. The results -- at least some -- will come.
8D: Heed the warning about behaving. Bron has left numerous comments, and it should be clear that she is not me. I also have IP logs to prove this. I have addressed the misleading arguments by David Staples (your link) here.
Sarah: So you are back. I hope that you plan on behaving. I still don't see "thick legs" in the picture you have pointed out.
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